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 > Kia, Hyundai: Please come to the rescue "Pathetic Quality"

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Lantley

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Posted: 09/15/21 09:03am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I think the prior post raise a good point.
All or at least most of the towable manufacturers that built a better unit are out of business.
Excel,Carriage,DRV are gone. We claim we want better, but we don't seem to support the companies that build a better unit.
When the time come we settle for the mass produced mediocrity vs. paying more for a better unit.


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valhalla360

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Posted: 09/15/21 09:55am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

rlw999 wrote:

toedtoes wrote:

So for most people, paying for a better quality vehicle is a no brainer. But for an RV, many folks will forego quality to get a better price, or get the floorplan or size they want.



I think the floorplan variety is part of the problem - like look at Forest River - they have 4 bumper pull travel trailer sub-brands (and that doesn't even include their fifth wheel and toy haulers), and each of those sub-brands has between 10 to 17 different floorplans.

There's no way they can develop custom jigs and other tooling devoted to each floorplan when they need to assemble 40 different varieties of TT, and they also can't develop best practices for how to assemble them because lessons learned on cable routing or how to mount the cabinets more securely aren't the same for each floorplan.


This is the fundamental problem.
- 30-50,000 units per year is marginal to keep a model of car going.
- A very popular RV model may do 5-10,000 per year.

There is no way to do a dedicated production line for each model of RV.

There are plenty of threads where people are looking for some oddball layouts...where those layouts exist, it's likely sales numbers in the 100's not even 1000's.

Home building is a much more comparable industry and anyone who has had a house built, knows there is a teething period where the contractor is called back to address issues.

On top of this, it's boom times for the industry and they can't hire enough workers...let alone high quality workers. Expecting them to give up 30-50% of sales when they are getting top dollar today is insanity.

Disrupting the market is far easier when the economy is down, particularly for a luxury item. Companies can be choosy about picking workers. Companies aren't under pressure to get more units out the door, so they can put more emphasis on quality and cutting warranty costs to protect thinner margins.

And to be quite honest, probably 90% of buyers of new RVs emphasize layout and cool looks over quality. The guys who buy so they can keep an RV for 20-30yrs are a negligible part of the market.


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Bluhorn

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Posted: 09/26/21 08:54am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Part of the problem is "Piecework" Which always did push quality down. Did you ever see a video of them building an rv? They aregetting paid on how many they can buil in a given time, not quality work. Now there is a bigger demand and the faster they go with less skilled workers and shortage of workers due to you know what. You dont expect quality to go up do you?


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Arn

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Posted: 10/03/21 12:44pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Given the proper training, the proper tools & a reason to want to do the job right (pay, pension, benefits etc) anybody anywhere can build quality anything. Look up the ladder, that's where the problem is.


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Arn

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Posted: 10/03/21 12:49pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

wildtoad wrote:

Don’t blame the line workers, blame the management for not doing a proper job of inspecting the work product at each step of the process. Most RV’s are built by hand unlike the modern automotive industry which uses a lot of robots and other automated processes. Ours was built missing a rear window, was missing floor heat register, the Dura Shield on the front had to be replaced twice as it came from the factory looking like bubble wrap. Yes the workers may have made an error, but obvious stuff should have been caught. What really frost my buttocks though is the crappy furniture and appliances that go into these things.

Unfortunately inspection is a lost art. In North American manufacturing there has been a major swing to self inspection. If I do it wrong without realizing it then it goes down the line like that. Owners save money by having a minimal quality department at the expense of, you guessed it, product quality.

vtraudt

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Posted: 10/03/21 01:03pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Arn wrote:


Unfortunately inspection is a lost art. In North American manufacturing there has been a major swing to self inspection. If I do it wrong without realizing it then it goes down the line like that. Owners save money by having a minimal quality department at the expense of, you guessed it, product quality.


And if supply and demand are somewhat in balance, then there IS a penalty (=cost) associated with low product quality.

But currently, it is and Indiana monopoly (the RV Mafia), and they get by even AFTER the 2021 price hike of 25% (last dealer survey).

majirameb

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Posted: 10/12/21 01:22am Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

A market size of $50 billion has been determined for electric vehicle financing in 2030, which is about 80 percent of the current size of the retail vehicle financing industry, which is now estimated at $60 billion. This statistic was studied by me back in the quarantine period. When I worked with Pacific Motors, I learned that they were investing less than it was making them a profit. The automotive industry is growing very rapidly, but because of people like Greta Tunberg we have to make environmentally friendly cars - and that's maximum cost, minimum cost and high income for the public.

* This post was edited 10/16/21 11:02am by majirameb *

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